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> Ferrari Project Car For Sale, Interesting challenge to restore?
fahrvergnugen
post Dec 5 2017, 12:19 AM
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A friend heard about a Phoenix surgeon who died and had a lot of astronomy equipment. But, the guy also had a passion for older cars.

In his garage is a Ferrari, which looks like the 288 GTO model (1983-1987, only 272 built). The body looks very good, but the interior needs significant work. Engine not known. Some parts are available but not sure if they are all there. I would be interested, but I am knee deep in cars now (8+) and don't need another project.

Contact me by PM if interested and I will direct you to the contact.

Mark


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Mark Shaw
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cgroppi
post Dec 5 2017, 03:07 PM
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QUOTE (fahrvergnugen @ Dec 5 2017, 01:19 AM) *
A friend heard about a Phoenix surgeon who died and had a lot of astronomy equipment. But, the guy also had a passion for older cars.

In his garage is a Ferrari, which looks like the 288 GTO model (1983-1987, only 272 built). The body looks very good, but the interior needs significant work. Engine not known. Some parts are available but not sure if they are all there. I would be interested, but I am knee deep in cars now (8+) and don't need another project.

Contact me by PM if interested and I will direct you to the contact.

Mark


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If that's a real 288 GTO, it's worth close to $1M even in that condition.


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Chris Groppi
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fahrvergnugen
post Dec 6 2017, 01:05 AM
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QUOTE (cgroppi @ Dec 5 2017, 04:07 PM) *
If that's a real 288 GTO, it's worth close to $1M even in that condition.


Not really....those $1M+ auction prices for the 288 GTO are based on fully complete and operational cars! This car is a basket case without any detail about all parts being included....:-(

The other major concern is the status of the title to this car. Is the title clear and legal, does the title show it as a salvage car, or does the title properly describe the vehicle. I have been down this route with lesser makes. A bogus title makes it a piece of junk to the high-dollar auction market.

I have an appointment this Saturday to take a closer look and determine a more realistic value.....

Of course, if the stats look really good... I may actually buy it! Not that I need another car... current status is 8.5 cars....:-(




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Mark Shaw
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cgroppi
post Dec 7 2017, 11:10 AM
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QUOTE (fahrvergnugen @ Dec 6 2017, 01:05 AM) *
QUOTE (cgroppi @ Dec 5 2017, 04:07 PM) *
If that's a real 288 GTO, it's worth close to $1M even in that condition.


Not really....those $1M+ auction prices for the 288 GTO are based on fully complete and operational cars! This car is a basket case without any detail about all parts being included....:-(

The other major concern is the status of the title to this car. Is the title clear and legal, does the title show it as a salvage car, or does the title properly describe the vehicle. I have been down this route with lesser makes. A bogus title makes it a piece of junk to the high-dollar auction market.

I have an appointment this Saturday to take a closer look and determine a more realistic value.....

Of course, if the stats look really good... I may actually buy it! Not that I need another car... current status is 8.5 cars....:-(


Last auction prices I've seen for complete cars is like $2-4M. So yeah, just under $1M for that one.

$3.9M https://rmsothebys.com/en/auctions/FF17/Fer...-288-gto/462193
$2.1M https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/23425/lot/77/
$2.4M https://www.goodingco.com/vehicle/1985-ferrari-288-gto-7/

The Haggerty valuation tool says a good one is worth $2.7M. A "Fair" one is still worth $1.9M.
https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools...ferrari-288_gto

So if they're going to sell it to you cheap, I guess it's your lucky day. But they should probably know how much it's actually worth if it's genuine.


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Chris Groppi
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fahrvergnugen
post Dec 8 2017, 12:06 AM
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QUOTE (cgroppi @ Dec 7 2017, 12:10 PM) *
Last auction prices I've seen for complete cars is like $2-4M. So yeah, just under $1M for that one.

$3.9M https://rmsothebys.com/en/auctions/FF17/Fer...-288-gto/462193
$2.1M https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/23425/lot/77/
$2.4M https://www.goodingco.com/vehicle/1985-ferrari-288-gto-7/

The Haggerty valuation tool says a good one is worth $2.7M. A "Fair" one is still worth $1.9M.
https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools...ferrari-288_gto

So if they're going to sell it to you cheap, I guess it's your lucky day. But they should probably know how much it's actually worth if it's genuine.


I don't think you got my drift....yes, that Ferrari model could fetch huge prices... but it needs to be fully restored with factory parts. With only 272 made back in the 1980s, it is pretty darn hard to find factory parts!

And the real kicker in this case.....after digging, I find that it has a "SALVAGE" title! The kiss of death. You cannot register or drive a car with a salvage title. If you restore it enoguh that a AZ DMV Inspection Level III will pass it as roadworthy, then the title can be upgraded to "restored" but that is still a form of "branded" title. Some insurance companies will not even insure a car with a branded title. It is a whole new ballgame.

My guess, looking at the good body and the extreme level that the prior owner went to to dismantle stuff that should not be touched.....this car was damaged in a flood situation. That presents a huge number of questions about just what works? A mid-1980s car started to have enough complex electrical and electronics that this could be the kiss of death.

I also pondered buying it and making it into a dedicated autocross car....NADA.... with only 272 of these made over 5 years it does not qualify as a "production" car and pretty much falls off the chart. Historically Ferrari tried to build this car for Group B Rally Class, but that class was later discarded and made the 288 GTO an obsolete orphan in motorsports.

What to do?


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Mark Shaw
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civil
post Dec 8 2017, 06:33 AM
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Sounds like you need to pick it up and have it mounted on the wall as art then...

Maybe like this?



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fahrvergnugen
post Dec 9 2017, 12:51 AM
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QUOTE (civil @ Dec 8 2017, 07:33 AM) *
Sounds like you need to pick it up and have it mounted on the wall as art then...

Maybe like this?



Yeah, that pretty much sums it up.

But, alas the situation is now out of our control. One executor of the estate decided that they will give the car and its parts for free to some of the owner's friends and they will then try to restore it and resell it to the benefit of the estate. I am not holding my breath on how that will work out since those friends have NO experience in restoring cars. Looks like a fools errand, but so be it.

Sad to see a limited production exotic car like this reduced to something has no more value than a 1980s Mustang....:-(


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Mark Shaw
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Project.D
post Dec 9 2017, 03:24 PM
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If it has a salvage title, I think it should still be able to be registered for the road. I drove a 1994 Civic with a salvage title for almost a year and a half, and the title transfer to my name, insurance and registration all went fine with no problems. It even passed emissions without a problem, then got traded in two months later after an electrical problem I'd just fixed the day before came back and the car would only start when it felt like it again. tongue.gif

On the other hand, I once walked away from a $450 driving 1991 Civic hatch that had a dismantle title. That thing needed an inspection just to get a salvage title (which of course the owner neglected to mention in the Craigslist ad, said it had a salvage title already), and it felt like it would fall apart any time during its test drive!


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TJ Triolo
On a break (not sure if permanent yet) from autocross
2004 Bluebaru WRX D Street - Soon to be for sale
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BWeikert
post Dec 11 2017, 10:51 PM
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My blue M3 that I autocrossed for years was a salvage title out of Colorado. It was both registered and insured for use on the street for many years before I sold it.

Insurance would even provide full coverage if I wanted, but if had been wrecked they would of course only pay a salvage title value so not worth carrying full coverage.


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Brian Weikert
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LP
post Sep 3 2018, 04:41 PM
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Contact F40 Motorsports in Portland Connecticut.

http://www.f40.com


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